tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8369178493944631168.post854848911546540544..comments2024-03-28T11:52:41.135+01:00Comments on Reims and Repeat: Where does students' English come from?Edwardhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10271630632944675542noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8369178493944631168.post-62414514270343785742013-03-21T19:05:08.127+01:002013-03-21T19:05:08.127+01:00Edward,
Your resident Grumpy Prescriptivist begs ...Edward,<br /><br />Your resident Grumpy Prescriptivist begs forgiveness: I am compelled to spoil your blog with my comment!<br /><br />In Paris also there is English everywhere, particularly in advertising, and not just because of tourism. We may hear about 'Franglais', but it has astonished me to have seen its prevalence and the general presumption of (I feel) a fairly advanced command of English. This is more or less invisible from the perspective of Britain!<br /><br />I must admit that I find this Anglophone pressure rather disconcerting, as is a Grumpy Prescriptivist’s duty, even without having French as a mother-tongue. (It is certainly distracting for an English-speaker learning French!). I would mind it less if it were a different kind of English. This has to do with your (rather good) line, "I don't care where your English comes from, as long as it is good". That has struck me, because the English of popular culture, the same English which is being taken up enthusiastically by young people in France, is not good at all, but brittle, careless and poor; and worse, to our shame, often filthy, as you have mentioned. It can help with learning English, but I feel it is hardly a good advertisement. And it is damaging French as well as English. I imagine that many French people must associate English with ugliness and vulgarity, and who can blame them? I think I would, if I were French. It just goes to show the responsibility which public figures and song-writers have, and often ignore. <br /><br />There, that is better now I’ve got that off my chest! Back to dreaming of an English Academy.Dominic Nhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10677839865135559479noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8369178493944631168.post-70595536402773269662013-03-20T11:53:22.204+01:002013-03-20T11:53:22.204+01:00Hello Sue! Thanks for the comment. Did you tell th...Hello Sue! Thanks for the comment. Did you tell them what the lyrics meant in the end? I can imagine it might not all have been suitable for 11-year-olds ...<br /><br />I assume that the announcement on 'foreign languages' would be the one contained in <a href="http://www.education.gov.uk/inthenews/inthenews/a00217388/overwhelming-support-for-foreign-languages-plan" rel="nofollow">this article</a>? To be honest, I've got mixed feelings about this ... on one hand, learning Latin is a very, very good idea, as it's a great way to give students a grasp of grammatical concepts, since you can't really teach it without adopting a grammar-based approach. However, you'd have to teach it very carefully indeed, since I can imagine many primary school students would find it incredibly boring without any spoken element to engage them. Also, surely you could incorporate the grammatical elements just by changing the way *modern* languages are taught ...<br /><br />... and speaking of modern languages, I have to agree that the choice offered by Michael Gove does seem a little random. When you compare the languages listed with <a href="http://global.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/329791/language/292862/Most-widely-spoken-languages" rel="nofollow">the most widely-spoken ones</a>, you start to wonder how he picked them. Urdu, for instance, has as many speakers as Spanish, Italian, German and French put together, so in terms of how useful it will be to its learners, you have to ask yourself why it wasn't included. Saying that schools can 'continue to teach them' outside the statutory choice strikes me as a red herring, since timetables are <a href="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/8774758/History-lessons-squeezed-out-of-crowded-timetables.htm" rel="nofollow">so squeezed already</a> that schools simply won't have the luxury.<br /><br />Oh, and seriously, how many state primary schools will be able to offer Ancient Greek? Edwardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10271630632944675542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8369178493944631168.post-71934052898082771472013-03-18T20:50:58.604+01:002013-03-18T20:50:58.604+01:00Hi Edward
Plus ça change...
Your post reminded me ...Hi Edward<br />Plus ça change...<br />Your post reminded me of when I was an assistante in Nantes in 1981/2 and the 6e wanted me to explain/translate the name of the group Soft Cell and their song Tainted Love...<br />Also, I don't know if you are aware of the recent announcement here in England that 'foreign languages' (as Mr Gove calls them) will be statutory in KS2 (primary school Years 3 - 6) from 2014. However, his choice to drop the 'modern' from MFL is calculated: English primary schools will have to choose from the following list - French, German, Spanish, Italian, Mandarin, Latin, Ancient Greek. There has already been consternation from many, arguing that Polish, Portuguese, Urdu, Punjabi, Arabic, Dutch, Roumanian and Hebrew (amongst others) are already being successfully taught in primary schools and should be recognised. Mr Gove says schools can of course continue to teach these, but that one of his [random?] 7 languages must be the 'statutory' choice. The consultation process on this proposed new curriculum is still open...Sue Shortnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8369178493944631168.post-79155158082685281772013-03-17T19:43:53.788+01:002013-03-17T19:43:53.788+01:00When do you start learning languages in France? So...When do you start learning languages in France? Some friends of mine are assistants in primary schools, but I imagine it becomes compulsory from age 11 ... if that's the case, then you're absolutely right: we need to start earlier! (The language education system in England should probably be the topic of another post entirely, although it might be a little unrelated to this particular blog ...)Edwardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10271630632944675542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8369178493944631168.post-73750664935879053802013-03-17T15:50:30.114+01:002013-03-17T15:50:30.114+01:00I got my English level from watching tv shows and ...I got my English level from watching tv shows and movie and reading books in English. I didn't have a lot of good English teachers and most of them weren't really that good at it... And that probably is why a lot of French people are pretty bad at English. And the fact that we start learning languages at the age where we are becoming less and less efficient to learn other languages..Lyra Sullyvanhttp://listesratures.over-blog.frnoreply@blogger.com